Any insight you can offer would be greatly appreciated. This is okay, as long as we learn from those mistakes and adjust our steps. Mars and Pluto certainly do about Scorpio. i imagine these aspects can point to a past life where there was dominance in the work field isuees? Pluto, Sun, Venus & Mercury in the 12th/Virgo. I fell onto another man after that whom I had a very deep dark sexual connection to and whom I shared a heavy 8th composite chart with. Its bad enough that we have difficulties with the 12th house when it involves the natal chart, but it often is downright cruel when were trying to negotiate its slippery slopes in a composite. What of mother-daughter pairs? I can say with absolute confidence that you perfectly captured the essence of this energy. Your article is amazing! *Composite Chiron conjunct Moon in Taurus in 12th house. Look at poor Kurt Cobain, who is the poster boy for this aspect. This might lead to a sense of belonging and having a lot of things in common. What is the best approach? Im so confused by this mix! Happy holidays and thank you for this article. Chiron In The Houses | Tea & Rosemary And we both natally have same aspects, my mars is in my 12th and his moon is in his 12th also. I have 3 planets in my natal chart in 12th house (mercury,sun,mars) and we have 2 planets,which are identical in my natal(mercury and sun), in the composite chart in 12th house with someone who i talked for 6 months but we never dated.We also have our moon in pisces in 6th house. I dont want to lose this relationship too so I would like to help me to find out the karmic lesson. Neptune is also in the 12th, but hanging back a bit and squaring Neptune- yikes. There is probably some sort of inequality and that can be good for employee/employer or guru/student relationships. Thanks for the kind and helpful words, Dawn. such is the nature of the 12th, beautiful and terrible.! The 12th house conjunction in Cancer indicates that there is a nurturing issue between you that needs resolving. Moon in Aries/7th, Saturn in the 5th/Aquarius. thanks you very much Dawn to shed some lights on this! I have my sun in the 12th house of my natal chart, and we both have venus in the 12th house of our natal charts. We could look at each other and read one anothers minds, but not in a way where you hear words or anything. AT ALL. What is the difference between Midpoint and Davison as Your opinion? Maybe someone else on the page will have an answer for you. I also have problems with communication in general, I tend to . An ex-lover and I share composite Sun/Mercury in the 12th. Dawn, thank you for writing this article. The inner planets are where we liveso yes, the 10th house stellium will have more influence on a day to day basis, and then once in a while the outer planets will come out to grab us with whatever their issues are, particularly by transit or progression to the stellium/12th. Pisces is the mutable water sign overseeing the 12th house. The lower expression has to be elevated, and the higher expression needs to be realized. Its not special, its common. It isnt that theyre unhappyno, they seem to go more the extreme of bliss altering with despair. Sorry Shannon, Dawn passed away a couple of years ago. So beautifully written Dawn. The house is famous for being the house of self-undoing, but it can also be the house where we find our fame and fortune. Whatever the motive, we know we are facing some sort of extremeand a choice. My concern is a grand trine in the composite chart, Mercury/Jupiter/Venus all conjunct in the 1st (pisces) trine Moon/North node conjunct in the 5th (cancer) and Neptune the chart ruler in the 9th (Scopio). My english is not very good. They help us understand that our capacity to love is its own reward. Very exquisitely put. The midpoint composite points out the places where the planets in the two charts manifest. I turned to astrology and within months I learnt a lot of things about this topic. Our mars is in cap in 3rd house and mars in 11th house libra. I am a pisces sun, mercury, mars. I think that your article is quite amazing, but for those of us who are making these relationships work for us I wish you would have given some cases in which it can work. We both experienced he physically (I think) something weird when i was very close to him and I saw something mind boggling in the night when Venus turned retrograde this year. I still could love this man with his faults which I know he has but he is so caring and nice. Composite Sun in the Houses - South Florida Astrologer The lesson they teach is that we do not have to possess love in order to experience it. They are tenacious and will not give up until they achieve their goals. Long story short it really bothered me that I can not tell him how I really feel about him because we are both ironically attending church but I felt that he really likes me as well. What should i do? In my opinion the midpoint composite is not really true, because our midpoint chart doesnt show the very intense physical love what we live together. i have it conjunct in our davison3rd house- and opposite in4th-10th in composite. I think this is SO true . Sometimes the twelfth house energies become lost, and we create false gods from what we cannot find within us (for example, those with Leo on the 12th house cusp may worship creative expression, but not be able to find it in themselves). VERY-VERY SORRY! I have read your response about 12th house and i really do agree with you. You mentioned that couples with 12th house emphasis usually come together for a specific purpose and once that is completed the relationship is destined to end (thats what I gathered anyway). Pluto is elevated in the composite chart close to the midheaven in the 9th. Also, forgive my double Virgo and the fact that I was once an editor: the phrase is unrequited love not unrequired. Sorry. The love you have for one another may be secret or private, and/or you are called upon to take a leap of faith in order to be with . There is a feeling of neglect present spiritually. Your generation, the one with Pluto/Uranus opposite Saturn in Virgo/Pisces, came into this life with a huge burden. I was wondering about my composite contacts with some I know who we share 12th house themes with. That may mean leaving you behind. Thank you for your insight. Thrown/compelled into a private relationship that feels confusing and unavoidable at the same time. The Moon squares Mercury and Venus in the 9th, Pluto and Saturn in the 3rd, and squares the MC. Composite The relationship is deep and beautiful and in periods hard for us to be with each other. .why is neptune conjunct sun so bad in composite? When transit Jupiter is in the composite 12th house, you may have more opportunities to come together behind the scenes, behind closed doors, when no one is watching, and in a professional relationship, this can be how you make lots of progress together. Comparing composites to the biwheel between two charts is impossible, like comparing apples and oranges. Transit Saturn in the Composite 12th House. Definitely karmic and unbreakable. He also has 12th house stellium in his own natal chart in Scorpio. But i ran of him, i really dont understand why, it makes me feel so sad. We were happy plutonicay together. Difficult to ground your energy. Another spin given to the 12th house . Trust me when I say that I will happily take a man i am less connected to, to allow myself the support I need to thrive in this life. Composite Jupiter in the 12th House With Composite Jupiter in the 12th house, you can find that subconscious issues and motivations, baggage and karma seem to be easier in this pairing, and they don't cause as many issues as they normally do. We become real magicians if we can tap into it. What gives a better idea of the relationship potential, synastry or composite? Transit Pluto in the Composite 12th House. Sometimes the ego gets in the way of our path, whether through fear, resistance to growth, resistance to break old habits and personal tendencies, or through a lack of interest in what is wanted of us. More, we have a 5 cluster Scorpio in 9 (Moon, Venus, Neptune, Jupiter and Mercury), a composite Sun in Sag in 10, with Pluto and Uranus conjunct in 7 and unaspectted Gemini NN in 4 we also have a lot of 6/12 house contacts in synastry and 21 conjunctions (far from being easy!) Even the sexual draw of 8th house connections can be replaced by more of them down the road, or by the excitement of the 5th. I still feel a strong connection to him, but in a way, I guess I have come to reasonable terms with not being with him. !.the telepathy is overwhelming me. So, the composite Venus and Saturn are also in the 12th house. That is really challenging chart I assume and I dont know whether I go for this guy or not. The higher powers are always tapping at the door, insisting on change, cleansing, and renewal from within (Pluto/Uranus in Virgo), but how do you do that if your connection to the other world and the higher powers are full of fear and resistant to the necessary dissolving that must occur (Saturn in Pisces). how this would manifest? We both feel we have been together over many lifetimes. I would very much like to ask a question about Sun opposition Neptune in a composite especially if it is found as double whammy in synastry.From what I have read from your articles that particular dynamic is extremely difficult to get a grasp of.However I am wondering what kind of effect would Pluto in the 12th trine Sun would have on that aspect in the composite which is also double whammy in synastry.Especially since Pluto is the ruler of the Ascendant and Jupiter,co-ruler of Pisces hits that angle.My question has to do with whether in this case the 1st house plays a heavy role in the chart and balances the chaotic power of Sun-Neptune or whether it is so fused with piscean energy that the plutonian core searching is not enough to get through the neptunian fog.I know that you should see the whole chart and that the question is a bit absurd but I think there is a pattern here and I would really like to know even your smallest bit of opinion on the matter.Thank you in advance. Saturn and Pluto and Ascedant. Thank You for Your answer and best regards from Hungary! And 1 more thing HIS VENUS opposes my vertex and my sun, venus and mercury on his ASC conjucts his Venus! I cannot be happy with him (I feel happy but it doesnt last any longer) or without him. So my final question is which method should I look onto (composite or synastry) as they both seem to go into totally different directionsand is it possible to reveal our secret relationship even with composite 12th house? We have experienced together so much and it helps my mental developement so much and also your idea about loving and letting go interests me a lot. I just met someone who has their moon in 12th house like myself and im wondering if i need to investigate this more closely. (excuse my bad English) My wife and I have composite moon in the 12 house (aquarius). Oh the powers of the 12th house. We have a composite Pisces Ascendant (3) with a Pisces Saturn in 12 conjunct Ascendant. The composite charts (both Davison and midpoint) need to be progressed. Thank you very much Dawn. Thoughts on this combo would be greatly appreciated by me. and then mars, Jupiter and neptune in the 2nd. Sun conj. Sorry, Natalia, I cant really comment on this in the space available. My natal Venus conjuncts composite IC and his natal Mars conjuncts composite MC. I have read at least books regarding the 12th house, and its not easy to comprehend the needs of the 12th. A lot of native speakers make this same mistake, and worse. Im not exactly sure what our future holds, but I do know we are exactly where we are supposed to be XOXO ~ Thank you for the lovely insights!!! And I read from Stephen Arroyo that it is so important to see the traditional rulers of the signs , for example in Aquarius is more important to see Saturn than Uranus. Talking about Fate! Like individuals with 12th house planets, couples with a lot of twelfth house may feel that there is something fated about their lives together. It is often said about this house that everyone else see's it before you do. They help us understand that our capacity to love is its own reward. What is important to each person in the relationship as far as values, is highlighted with a second sun house in addition to how the couple supports themselves financially, accumulates possessions, and enjoys earthly pleasures. VERY-VERY SORRY! . Neptune tries to tell us that we cant own anything permanently, and if we try to possess and not understand the message of universal love (love is its own reward) it will pry our grasping fingers off of whatever we are trying to hold on to. We have the ultimate intimacy side by side with the knowledge of ultimate separateness. We get along very well but our relationship is being kept in secret (which sucks) and the Saturn and Pluto opposite Asc. Sun conjunct Neptune is a very difficult thing to live with in a composite chart. This resonates with me. Everyone longs for melding and merging in relationship, but the truth is that separateness makes us interesting to one another. Im a Pisces sun 7house. Thank You so much for Your answer! I f these planets and points are emphasized in the synastry chart, chances are that you have dealt with each other before. I need help! I cant stop the regretful feelings. Thank you very much. Im blessed to remember some past lives weve had and we have definitely come together to mend some old wounds and learn to forgive and love one another. However, humans are imperfect, and complete faith is hard to keep up all of the time. Do you think that is true? Telepathy, visiting one another out of body, lucid dreaming where they communicate with one another, strange psychic links and melding of the two energetic bodies. Lovely article. Chiron in Taurus 12 th House gives rise to feelings of dissatisfaction and indifference. Our synastry with my beloved couple is very strong with good connections between both 1th and 7th house rulers and many positive aspects like double whammy saturn-moon, and positive ascendant-moon, ascendant-venus, venus-moon, and so warm and intense pluto conj. I've been hearing it's some kind of unrequited love for the venus person's part, but . What the twelfth house demands of us always is that we give the ego a rest, but often challenges regarding the ego are exactly what we have to face with twelfth house planets. I am 38 years old and have a Scorpio 12th house stellium (Sun, Moon, Mars, Mercury, and Neptune) so I am painfully, and blissfully, intimately aware of this energy. What to make of this? We are still friends and well always love each other. Thats for start. Chiron in Taurus, Chiron in the 12th House - Astrology Owl cheers:). The feelings I have are much deeper than lust and infatuation. Sun and Neptune both trine Lilith, who is in Pisces AND in house 12. There are lots of couples with heavy 12th house influence who are out in the open. taurus venus-mars conjunction in Your opinion? The 12th house has to do with summarizing and accepting all that has come before it, whereas first house planets are very pure, almost innocent, in their expression. Its the last chance to get it right, and there will be a struggle to use this planets positive expression easily. Together, they like to dive deeper and deeper into unknown and mysterious beliefs, cultures, territories, and ideas. Impossible to comment without seeing both charts. Wow very insightful thank you so much, I love your writing!! With the composite 12th house in Aries, it may be difficult at times for you to take initiative together when needed, and instead that kicks in when youre moving together subconsciously. And I read from Stephen Arroyo that it is so important to see the traditional rulers of the signs , for example in Aquarius is more important to see Saturn than Uranus. Its weird weird weird . We are fated, but we are meant to part. Sometimes learning from the mistakes IS the path. chiron is opposed to uranus with the moon/mercury midpiont conjnuct uranus. He is a pisces/cap/aquar with cap moon in 12th house. this is honestly so beautiful to read. now chiron. This can make them appear easily influenced by others, which could lead them to not knowing what direction they should take with their lives. Jul 28, 2011. . His sun scorpio falls into my fourth house in my natal chart and mine ,cancer, falls into his 8th. (anyone who has ever fallen in love and had planets with that person in 12th composite will know..). Find a way to bring the god down to the day to day world, so that it, too, is considered sacred. I have gone through a long, long cycle of heartaches and have been able to slowly, heart-wrenchingly get over each and every one, except this guy. Please advise if we can make it to marriage or our relationship is doomed. The south node lies there on the natal composite. I am Sun in Aries, Asc in Leo and Moon in Aquarius, and he is Sun in Leo, Asc in Gemini and Moon in Leo. IF THIS IS NOT A TRAGIC LOVE STORY THAN WHAT IS? Therefore difficult aspects to composite Chiron need to be noted. I have forgotten to say, as for HIS Lilith, its conjunct my Desc (orb -1) which is an interaspect I cant give meaning to, (too hard to analyse for me) but however, it also is a new lilith matter. The story of your inability to connect probably has more to do with your individual chart comparisons than the composite chart. My boyfriend and I have 4-5 planets in the 12th house in our composite progressed chart. The composite Sun in the first suggests the couple has come together for strength. I was immediately flooded with emotion- I realized all at once how intensely close to him I was and needed to know if he was ok, etc. There is also a Mars in the 12th that doesnt get really any support from anything. They do not, however, lose interest once they have completed their aim. Concentrate on intimacy and you should be all right. Chiron in Scorpio, Chiron in the 12th House - Astrology Owl I have 12th house with my partner, but also many Saturn and Pluto Aspects. along with Juno. We have (taurus) mars-venus conjunction on the 12th house and it is so real in our life: we need so strong the deep intimacy and the so close physical and spiritual nearness together, and it is better for us to be alone together for our happiness. what do you think it means to have such much weight in the 1st and 12th houses? And it KILLS ME! Planets in the 12th are considered to be undevelopd or lacking something in terms of karma. But on the whole the midpoint chart is a chart about the essence and purpose of a relationship and the Davison chart is more about the external realities of a relationship. We are each in our mid 60she never married, and I (a widow) married 25 yearsto a Pisces. Ive recently broke up with what was felt the love of my life the most pure and locvng relationship ever. I noticed you dont offer composite readings. In my experience, if you have a good synastry but a difficult composite, the couple get along with one another but have problems establishing the relationship in the outside world. Both of us are on a spiritual path, which is very important to each of us. I am so sad because I would have never meet him IF my husband and this man, and his wife would not become friends with him in church, ( I did not go to church for a while so I would not meet them!) Its impossible to do one without composites or progressed composites. Jupiter Rx in the 7th in Leo. Hi WhitelotusI use both the Midpoint and the Davison charts in synastry. On the one hand We are meant to be on the other, But if we are, why is it so hard?, When a couple has planets, or an important planet, in the 12th, it can go a couple of ways. Our situation was kind of complicated. In order to respect this aspect, we need to have reverence for all the cycles of life, not just the upswing. If a commitment to each other happens, the seventh and eighth houses come more clearly into focus. He says what on thinking. I am sufficiently haunted. thanks!! We are very romantic together and trust each other. When it comes to relationship troubles, try taking an alternative approach. We dont really grasp whats in the 12th until we spiritualize it, remove the ego from the planets function. We feel it has a nebulous, yet mysteriously powerful influence on our lives when we have planets there, even though we cant quite fathom the type of influence it wieldsare we being seduced to a precipitous cliff by external forces, or are the demons within driving us to the edge? Im afraid that you would need a full synastry reading in order to make sense of the situation for you and your wife. Outer planets have to do with things that are beyond our control. Our synastry with my beloved couple is very strong with good connections between both 1th and 7th house rulers and many positive aspects like double whammy saturn-moon, and positive ascendant-moon, ascendant-venus, venus-moon, and so warm and intense pluto conj. We find with the Clinton composite chart (see chart at the top of the next page) that the planet Chiron conjunct Venus in the 3rd house, which semi-sextiles . This is not only with regards to emotions but also physically. In composite we have north node in 12th. In a negative way, the struggles within the partnership will cause the Pluto person to see where his or her behaviour needs adjusting. (You can have this without the 12th of course, but the 12th is inclined to it.) No one could share that kind of information with a person that he/she newly know. Mercury in the first is a good aspect to have because of the communication involved and the ability to think clearly regarding the relationship. We met one day and it was ON, mutual, and understood without saying word. Thanks for this very interesting article about that controversial 12th house and I totally agree with your final paragraph. Subconciously I always looked at him for a few seconds like a magnet but did not put any thought to it. . Mars & NNode in Cancer/10th. It was emotional and intense, also warm and familiar at the same time. Sometimes we will be asked to make leaps of faith. Obviously, I thought this man was my soulmate. Im sorry, but all of the aspects you mentioned can be used as excuses to pull you back into a relationship that has ended for the other person: in particular, the trines. *And in Synastry- My Chiron RIsing (asc in Taurus) sits in his 12th house) When synastry presents itself on the Pluto/Node conjunction, the partner to the Pluto person will instigate growth, either from a negative or positive stimulus. i give it much meaning because i really feel a psychic connection and a karmic fate, but again that could be just me since i have a heavy neptune but nothing in my natal 12th. Chiron sextile or trine the Sun, Moon, . I can honestly say that I love this man from the highest level of my being, but I dont feel we belong together in a committed relationship. The only way that you can figure out the main issue of karma in a relationship is to examine the nature of both Nodes and their rulers in the Composite, along with aspects to the Nodes. With Lilith so deeply involved, this relationship has a direct bearing on your feelings about your sexual power. Its also trine to the moon and sextiling Uranus. Sense of self and feeling of completeness comes from your identification with the Divine. When the transit Moon is in the composite 6th house, you may be a little emotionally picky in the relationship, and can be a little judgy with one another.